Thursday, July 27, 2006

can i believe anything i want and be a united methodist?

I read this book today. A friend gave it to me about eight years ago, and it took me this long to read it. This is a great little book that discusses the fact that the United Methodist Church does have specific doctrinal standards. Abraham puts forth that in the last generation we've become a pluralistic denomination, holding to no specific doctrine. He brings out the fact that our Disciple and our Constitution do have clear doctrinal standards which tie us permanently to classic orthodox historic apostolic Christianity. He calls for the teaching of these doctrines and ifor holding our clergy and members accountable to them. Abraham says we need to stop acting like we're not a confessional church when we actually have a Confession of Faith!


Anonymous said...


Based on the current rulings of the Judicial Council, I would with great sadness, concern, and righteous indignation, yes.
Note that it is not that Bishop Sprague was tried for heresy and acquitted. This is a more serious problem: the official church will not even consider heresy. If the evidence against Bishop Sprague is not sufficient enough to lead to a trial (apart from the question of whether Sprague is guilty), then it must be concluded that in the present climate in the church heresy is an impossibility. Then the accusations against United
Methodism are true: one can believe anything and be United Methodist. Standards are not standards. Truth is not truth. There is no center.

Paragraph 130 of the Discipline which speaks of connectionalism and makes reference our common tradition of faith including our Doctrinal Standards and our General Rules, carries no meaning. There is no common tradition. Likewise, there is no unity

Here are the beliefs of Bishop Sprague which the a four person committee, headed by Bishop Bruce R. Oughfound found acceptable:

(1) The belief that Jesus is not the only way to salvation. Bishop Sprague called such a belief "an arrogant claim." Of course, Bishop
Sprague's refusal to accept faith in Christ as the only way to salvation makes Jesus into a fool. If there are other ways to salvation, then the death of Jesus was totally unnecessary. The death of Christ for the forgiveness of sins of those who believe in Him is, according to Bishop Sprague, "superstition at best" and idolatry at worst.

(2) The belief that Jesus was not born of a virgin.

(3) The belief that Jesus did not physically rise from the dead.

(4) The belief that Jesus was not born the Christ. Bishop Sprague says that Jesus became the Christ by "the confluence of grace with faith."

Sophia/Goddess Worship


"Pulpit swap"



Articles about Dr. Maulana Karenga and what Kwanzza really is,


Universalism - Kalen Kristad

Some of the Churches at Which Rev. Fristad Has Spoken:
> Maple Grove United Methodist Church, West Des Moines, Iowa, Rev. Robert Crandall, 515-287-1545
> Trinity United Methodist Church, Cedar Rapids, Iowa, Rev. Blair Frank, 319-362-5259
> St. James United Methodist Church, Cedar Rapids, Iowa, Rev. Susan Detwiler, 319-363-3119
> United Church of Christ in Sun City, Sun City, California, Rev. Hal Lingerman, 909-679-1149
> Holy Nativity Episcopal Church, Los Angeles, California, Rev. Peter Rood, 310-670-4777
> Sierra Madre United Methodist Church, Sierra Madre, California, Rev. Holly Reinhart-Marean, 626-355-0629
> Murrieta United Methodist Church, Murrieta, California, Rev. J. T. Greenleaf, 909-677-6174
> Temecula United Methodist Church, Temecula, California, Rev Randy Johnson, 909-676-1800
> First Filopino-American United Methodist Church, Hacienda Heights, California, Rev. Lisa Gay Santiago, 626-336-6566
> United Church of the Valley, Murrieta, California, Rev. Randy Leisey, 909-698-1520
> Faith United Methodist Church, Webster City, IA, Rev. Brian Carter, 515-832-4787
> Monroe Street and Jordonia United Methodist Churches, Nashville, TN, Rev. Rosemary Brown, 615-383-2686
> Unitarian Universalist Fellowship, College Station, TX, Rev. Liz Brown, 979-696-5285
> Highland Park United Methodist Church, Stillwater, OK, Rev. Andrew Hall, 405-372-8001
> King's Chapel, Boston, MA, Rev. Earl Holt, 617-227-2155

Same Sex Marriages

I think I said enough. As for me and my house, I will serve the Lord.

John Flores
Frisco, Texas

Anonymous said...


I have read this book several times.

Can we all fit under one umbrella?

What can we learn from our Episcopalian brothers?

John Flores
Frisco, Texas

John said...

I read this book last semester for a class. It's a good'un.

Maybe the Articles of Religion ought to be read every now and then in church. And among ministry candidates, too. There's something wrong with people getting through ordination while saying, "I don't believe in Original Sin or Total Depravity."

Jason Woolever said...

I agree. I'm really digging the Confession of Faith of the EUB that we adopted as part of the doctrinal standards of the UMC.

Its great to know that we do have the doctrine to teach.

Brett said...

You have voiced my concerns exactly. Not that John Wesley is the standard (the Bible is), but I doubt he would recognize the present day church that is named after him. I get pretty worked up when I start thinking about it.
I especially get worked up when I hear that we should preach the gospel, and when necessary, use words. What would Wesley say to that? Not much need to get on his horse and ride all over the country just to keep his mouth shut.