Wednesday, December 20, 2006

does God contradict himself?

Ray Pritchard recently posted a very good article where he challenges those who teach unbiblical doctrines based on the argument "God told me in my heart..."

4 comments:

Brian said...

Without getting into the middle of that particular debate, it does raise an interesting question. That is, does God's revelation continue today? I understand that Scripture contains everything necessary for salvation, but I wouldn't interpret that as necessarily meaning that God has been quiet since the Bible was assembled in its final form.

You've probably seen the UCC signs or commercials that say "God is still speaking." If that's the case, who's to say whether what they claim to be hearing from God is authentic or not? I'm not sure what I think, but it is an interesting and troubling question. If we believe in an active and involved God, who is to say that he isn't speaking to someone? Maybe even to Jay Bakker...or maybe someone even crazier?

Anonymous said...

I recommend a reading of the Letter of Jude. False teachers with their own "dreams" (personal revelation) and agendas were predicted and we are to contend for the faith as it was passed on to the saints.

Jude 1:3 ESV
Beloved, although I was very eager to write to you about our common salvation, I found it necessary to write appealing to you to contend for the faith that was once for all delivered to the saints. For certain people have crept in unnoticed who long ago were designated for this condemnation, ungodly people, who pervert the grace of our God into sensuality and deny our only Master and Lord, Jesus Christ.

8 Yet in like manner these people also, relying on their dreams, defile the flesh, reject authority, and blaspheme the glorious ones

17 But you must remember, beloved, the predictions of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ. They said to you, “In the last time there will be scoffers, following their own ungodly passions.” It is these who cause divisions, worldly people, devoid of the Spirit. But you, beloved, build yourselves up in your most holy faith; pray in the Holy Spirit; keep yourselves in the love of God, waiting for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ that leads to eternal life. And have mercy on those who doubt; save others by snatching them out of the fire; to others show mercy with fear, hating even the garment stained by the flesh.

Brian,

I think you will agree with me that the canon of scripture is closed. The Book of Mormon, Christian Science teachings, Papal Encyclicals, and personal revelation that contradicts the teachings of Jesus and the Holy Scripture are heresy.
But I do believe with certainty that God speaks to us via the Holy Spirit and miracles are happening around us.

The Holy Spirit calls some to ministry. Jason, care to comment on this?

Prayers are answered by God. We sometimes miss the answer or are embittered when God's answer is 'no'.
But if someone told me they saw the face of God and lived to tell about it, I would question it. (Think the Burning Bush encounter Moses had.)

If someone said they raised the dead, I would pray for discernment.

One of our Asbury graduates at Custer Road UMC told us a story when he was a seminarian and they went to a home of a lame woman. She asked for prayer. They formed a circle around the woman and prayed over her. She got up and walked. He said, he was not sure who was more surprised the woman or the semanarians. I know this minister, I believe this miracle was the will of God.

Then there people such as this.
David Hogan has a teaching series "Faith to Raise the Dead".
http://www.fathersglory.com/insp/David_Hogan-2.htm

Here is an opposing view of David Hogan's Ministry.
http://www.pfo.org/exploits.htm

If you made just one of the claims David Hogan makes, how would your home church respond...

I'm praying for discernment ... especially concerning the text that the "antichrist will peform signs and wonders and fool the very elect".

I don't feel really elect right now.

Your fellow brother in Christ,

John Flores
Frisco, Texas

Keith Taylor said...

Well of couse God still speaks and tells people what to do and is not silent. I mean, how you folks in the clergy always describe how you chose your vocation. Most say, "I was called into the ministry."

Well, let me ask you a question, if God doesn't speak anymore, then, "who called you?"

Now the larger question of if it is a false claim or not. If it contradicts the Bible, it cannot be real. But bigger than that. There are many people doing ministry that I am not sure they were called for. That is equally bad. For example, I would love to be a pastor. I can see myself doing that job. But I am not called to do that job, I was called to be an engineer. Many will say that if I quit my engineering career and went to seminary, that I'd be more in line with doing the Lord's work. I'd say, that is a not true. God hasn't called me to do that.

I think we have many of our problems in the modern church today because we have pastors who chose that as their vocation, but God didn't choose them for that vocation. I think it would be very beneficial to focus on learning to pray dilligently, but also to LISTEN dilligently. I know that I personally have a hard time with that one.

Jason Woolever said...

I agree that God is still speaking to hearts through the Holy Spirit. However, I also believe that the Scriptures are given us as to rebuke us, correct us, and train us in the right way to go (II Tim.3:16). Our heart feelings should be tested, confirmed, rebuked, corrected, etc, by the written Word.